Bridgestone Motorcycle Parts Discussion Board
General Category => General Discussion => Topic started by: Gerrit on September 07, 2013, 04:14:48 AM
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I have tried to find information on which company or individual imported Bridgestones into the Netherlands but so far have found no info at all- does anybody have any information about this? Obviously SOMEBODY did- when the Dutch magazine "Motor" wrote an article in 1972 about the 125 twin Jos Schurgers had built using the 175 Dual Twin engine as a basis (with Jörg Möller designing the crankshaft, cylinders, pistons and exhausts), the editor wrote that only a few Dual Twins had been sold. In those pre-internet days it would have been unlikely that Jos had obtained an engine from abroad.
Furthermore, in 1969 "Motor" briefly described a 175 Dual Twin engine which had been converted for the 125 class by a certain Han Leenheer of the Hague, mentioning that Han offered the result as a production racer including special parts such as straight-cut primary drive and different ratios for 4th and 5th gear to others. Presumably the cylinders and heads had also been modified, though the article doesn't say so. The special parts were also available separately for those who wanted to build the engine themselves. There is a photo of the upper crankcase half with crankshaft, primary drive and gearbox input shaft with some of the gears, and another photo of a frame which Cees van Dongen had designed and built for a 125 Bridgestone before he was offered the use of an ex-Anscheidt 125 Suzuki twin for the 1969 season.
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Gerrit
I can confirm (as you probably already know) that BS Motorcycles were imported into the UK and South Africa. Could it be possible that some bikes may have come to the Netherlands from those countries?
Ray
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It certainly is possible, though I consider it unlikely that import was done on an individual basis by a private person. I am currently checking my issues of "Motor" pre-1971 for ads or any other mention of an official importer, but so far a blank. It's almost as if the brand never existed as far as this country was concerned.
I consider it far more likely that one of the larger Dutch dealers imported them (though in very limited quantities), in the way most Japanese brands started in European countries. Kawasaki is a good example with Henk Vink's Bruinsma being their importer for many years before KHI took over, though many of the key Bruinsma staff ended up working for Kawasaki Motors Netherlands.
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You might try contacting this eBay seller and see if he has any answers to your questions. He's been selling nos Bridgestone parts for a number of years. Was he an importer back in the day or did he get these parts from someone who was?
http://www.ebay.com/itm/BRIDGESTONE-motorcycle-175-neutral-switch-case-1767-8000-175-50-60-90-200-350-/161101811552?pt=Motorcycles_Parts_Accessories&hash=item25826a8f60&vxp=mtr#ht_670wt_1399 (http://www.ebay.com/itm/BRIDGESTONE-motorcycle-175-neutral-switch-case-1767-8000-175-50-60-90-200-350-/161101811552?pt=Motorcycles_Parts_Accessories&hash=item25826a8f60&vxp=mtr#ht_670wt_1399)
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Hi Gerrit, in the late 60s and early 70s i worked as a motor cycle mechanic for Chester Motor cycle dealer Bill Smith, who was the official importer of Bridgestones in the U/K. As spares were getting difficult to get , especially for accident damaged bikes, new bikes were stripped for parts and also crashed bikes, and the parts sold. As Bill and his workshop manager Steve Murray ( who rode a 50cc works Bridgestone at Assen ) were regular riders at the Isle of Man TT, they had a Dutch friend who also was a regular TT rider. His name is Jan Costwinder, and it is possible Jan took a bike or engine back to Holland for Jos Schurgers, i can't prove this but it seems to me extremely possible. Regards Bob.
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According to the 1972 article, Jos obtained the Bridgestone from a certain Jan Bastiaans, who had tried- without much success- to turn the 175 into a 125 racer. There are no "before" photos so I don't know exactly what Jos obtained from Jan B, but the "after" photos clearly show a very strong resemblance to the 50 cc Van Veen Kreidler- hardly surprising as Jos had ridden the VV Kreidlers in the 1971 season.
Jan Kostwinder was the only Dutch rider to compete at the IoM in the late 60s and early 70s and it's by no means impossible that he obtained some Bridgestone parts from the UK. I don't know whether Jan K and Jan B were acquainted, though.
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Hi Gerrit,
Are the photos of the straight gears available in the "Motor" archives?
thanx paul
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I don't know whether "Motor" has a separate photo of the primary gears, the published pic is a photo of the inverted upper case half with crankshaft (without outer main bearings), gearbox input shaft with the modified gears and the straight-cut primary drive. I can try to scan the page if you're interested.
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I think Bridgestone Tire Company had a Netherlands office/distributor in the 1960's. Could the motor bikes have come thru them?
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Hi Gerrit,
I would be interested in seeing the photo.
Thanx paul
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Jos Schurgers 125 twin.....
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I think its interesting that Jos Schurgers raced the machine as a "Bridgestone", even though most of the machine was something else. The race results said Bridgestone, Bridgestone was painted on the bike etc.
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Page has been scanned! PM me with your e-mail addy if you would like a copy.
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Thanx Gerrit!
Would be interesting to know how that motor ran. I would love to have a set of the straight cut primaries.
paul
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I doubt whether anybody still has a spare set lying around, so the only option would be to get Nova or another gear maker to make straight-cut gears using the original helicals as a pattern. Won't be cheap, but better spend your pocket money on such stuff than on Booze, Fags and Wicked Women ;)...... though one might give the Wicked Women the benefit of the doubt!
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Thanx Gerrit!
Would be interesting to know how that motor ran. I would love to have a set of the straight cut primaries.
paul
They wouldn't do much except make more noise. There is very little difference in friction loss with straight vs. helical. At the GP level that .1 HP might be important, but not at the amateur level. Vince Gunning may have some lying around, they had some Nova gearsets, I believe. The big thing about straight cut gears is that they are much easier to design and manufacture, so if you are making one-off or a few special sets with different ratios, that is the way most race teams go.
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I picked up all issues of the Dutch magazine "Motor" for 1967 and 1968 recently and thanks to them the mystery has been solved. In issue 5 of Feb. 3rd 1967 "Motor" announced that "Het Motorpaleis" in Rotterdam and RAMO N.V. in Eindhoven were the new joint importers. The only bike they imported was the 175 Dual Twin which was the subject of a brief test in the next issue. Price hadn't been set but was expected to be about 2,350 guilders or about $650 at the then current exchange rate. The issue for the Amsterdam motorcycle show of 1967, No. 11, lists the DT but no price.
Issue No. 8 of Feb. 23rd 1968, the issue for the 1968 Amsterdam show, mentions that the 350 twin would not be imported, Bridgestone's sole product remained the 175 DT, priced at 2,295 guilders or $637.50. The bike's importer was RAMO N.V., now in Nuenen.
By the 1969 Amsterdam show Bridgestone were no longer being imported, presumably sales of the DT had been disappointing. Was not importing the GTR a missed opportunity?