Author Topic: 175 DT - 1966  (Read 29116 times)

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Re: 175 DT - 1966
« Reply #20 on: December 29, 2014, 03:50:08 PM »
   I don't have an answer to your questions but if it's any consolation the crank and cases on the 350 I've just stripped look almost identical to yours. Only the water damage on mine is on the right side. We could get together and make one good one. A 262cc GDTR ! ;D :D ;D, that'd be a first.
      I think it would be ok to use the cases but am open to guidance from others. I'm looking to acquire another crank or rebuild the damaged one with replacement parts as required. Won't be cheap as we all know. Good luck
                   Brian.
     
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Offline dcr

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Re: 175 DT - 1966
« Reply #21 on: December 30, 2014, 02:24:17 PM »
Brian, count me in but only if we add a sidecar.
1966 175 DT and 1968 350 GTR

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Re: 175 DT - 1966
« Reply #22 on: January 02, 2015, 09:15:25 AM »
 Dan,
        Sounds good to me but which side would the chair go !!   Might be better with a Trike.   :D :D
     I can fully appreciate how you feel, I was really teed off when I discovered the condition of my crank, the rest of the bike and engine is in great shape, you can't win them all but one would be nice. There's not much feedback on your questions, from other members.              Brian.
Growing old is compulsory, Growing up is optional.

Offline slawsonb

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Re: 175 DT - 1966
« Reply #23 on: January 02, 2015, 03:16:22 PM »
Dan, my opinions on your questions:
The engine case: The pits appear pretty deep. If they can be polished (more) smooth that would help to minimize the likelyhood of trapping oil and any foriegn matter. If this can't be smoothed alot I would say the engine case is suspect.
The crank: I would give it a good dip in evaporust (or your weapon of choice) and a good polishing with a fine wire brush or wheel after each soaking (may take more than one) to get as much of the rust as possible. Then assess the damage that is left in the same light as the engine case. Pulling the bearings and journals off the pins will let you get all the nasties out around the big end bearings. Probably all  the bearings on the "bad side" need to be replaced.
...bert

Offline dcr

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Re: 175 DT - 1966
« Reply #24 on: January 03, 2015, 11:32:11 AM »
Thanks Bert. I may have found a crank with a slightly trashed right side and really good left side. If things work out, and hey why wouldn't they, I can combine the crank pieces to form 1 good one. Steve Reed, get your 175 crank jigs ready.

I am going to try and polish out the pits on the left side of the case to make it usable. If I cant use this case, I will be HIGHLY disappointed.
1966 175 DT and 1968 350 GTR

Offline OldSwartout

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Re: 175 DT - 1966
« Reply #25 on: January 03, 2015, 05:45:21 PM »
I may be in the minority here, but if it was mine, I'd sandblast or aggressively wire brush the case and reuse it without worry.  Covering/protecting the sealing and bearing mounting surfaces, of course. You just want to be certain there isn't any remaining debris to come loose and cause secondary damage.
Karl Swartout
Mooresville, IN
BS175 Roadracer
BS350 GTR

Offline slawsonb

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Re: 175 DT - 1966
« Reply #26 on: January 03, 2015, 08:01:13 PM »
Yep, I have become so sandblasting averse that I forget to consider it as a good approach for this kind of a situation.

Karl, any downside from a bottom end oiling pov by creating too much clerance around the crank journals?

...bert

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Re: 175 DT - 1966
« Reply #27 on: January 04, 2015, 10:13:38 AM »
Not that I'm aware of. You won't be adding much clearance, anyway, just blasting away the accumulated oxidation/dirt/rust.  It'll just be a little pitted with a rougher surface than normal.
Karl Swartout
Mooresville, IN
BS175 Roadracer
BS350 GTR

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Re: 175 DT - 1966
« Reply #28 on: January 07, 2015, 03:52:43 PM »
 Dan,
        Took my corroded 350 cases to a workshop that does vapour blasting here in the UK. The owner is well known for rebuilding two strokes, particularly Kawasaki triples. His immediate reaction was, clean the cases and they will be fine to reuse. He had cleaned up and reused much worse in the past. So there's the answer to one of your questions. Get the crank rebuilt and you've got the basis of a good engine, that's the way I'm going.
Brian.
Growing old is compulsory, Growing up is optional.

Offline dcr

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Re: 175 DT - 1966
« Reply #29 on: January 16, 2015, 11:25:38 AM »
Found another 175 crank with equal and opposite damage to the right side. I should be able to make 1 good crank with the good sides of these 2.

Anyone know what the story is on the center bearing? The crank at the top of the picture is the original 1966 crank - the one at the bottom is the one I just obtained. The center bearings are different, but the parts manual only lists 1 part number. The addition of the second hole and the elimination of the center groove seems odd. I was able to get a new NOS center bearing and it is like the one on the bottom picture.

Thoughts?
« Last Edit: June 09, 2015, 09:48:11 PM by dcr »
1966 175 DT and 1968 350 GTR

Offline bsracer

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Re: 175 DT - 1966
« Reply #30 on: January 17, 2015, 10:40:36 AM »
If you look at your cases I'm assuming there is no hole for a locating dowel (pin) for the center bearing. The groove in the bearing is how the bearing was lubricated. There was no need to "locate" the bearing as the oil/mixture just filled the groove. The lower pic bearing is lubed via the two holes that line up in accordance with the locating dowel. I think I've seen three different type bearings. I will have to look, but I think the early one like you have in the upper pic is a ball bearing. The later type are roller bearing. Early parts books show the bearing and different seal (20mm ID vs 28mm) part numbers. Later cranks have a sleeve to adapt the 28mm seal. You may have a difficult time mixing and matching because the later bearing will have to be "lined up" by hand since there is no locating dowel.

paul

p.s. I've attached a pic of two types of roller bearings. One has a bronze cage with separate rollers. The other should be like the one in the bottom pic
« Last Edit: January 17, 2015, 10:43:32 AM by bsracer »

Offline dcr

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Re: 175 DT - 1966
« Reply #31 on: January 17, 2015, 11:14:17 AM »
Paul, thanks for the info. I was able to slide the outer portion of the center bearing over on both and both are needle bearings. Both of the originals are shot as the needles are rusted. I won't know until I get them apart but hopefully I can use the outer part of the original center bearing with the new inner needle portion. Otherwise I'm not sure how this is going to work out.

Dan
1966 175 DT and 1968 350 GTR

Offline bsracer

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Re: 175 DT - 1966
« Reply #32 on: January 18, 2015, 02:00:25 PM »
Maybe you can attach a pic? If you are going to the trouble of splitting the crank I would recommend changing out the complete new bearing and not mixing an old outer with a new inner.

paul

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Re: 175 DT - 1966
« Reply #33 on: January 18, 2015, 02:41:35 PM »
Wish I didn't have to split either crank but both have bad center bearing, both have a conrod that has rusted bearing and a beat up side. Once I get them split, I will fill a box with enough good parts to assemble 1 good crank and ship the box off to Steve Reed for assembly. He has the necessary jig and press to assemble correctly.

Dan
« Last Edit: June 09, 2015, 09:47:21 PM by dcr »
1966 175 DT and 1968 350 GTR

Offline dcr

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Re: 175 DT - 1966
« Reply #34 on: March 21, 2015, 02:06:20 PM »
Toreador Red Metallic - looked good on the shelf. Doesn't match the original color like I thought it would. This is 1 light coat over a champagne metal flake base coat. The pictures don't really show it, but the champagne metallic base coat looks pretty cool through the red top coat.

Against the original side cover, the difference is painfully obvious. Im not totally against this color, but not sure if I am in favor of it either.
« Last Edit: June 09, 2015, 09:46:33 PM by dcr »
1966 175 DT and 1968 350 GTR

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Re: 175 DT - 1966
« Reply #35 on: June 08, 2015, 04:32:46 PM »
A quick update on the progress of this bike. I found a local guy to tackle the crank issues. I have new pins, bearings and seals. Hope to drop it off Wednesday for rebuilding. Once that is done, I can get the motor together. I sent the rear fender and a set of rear shocks out to be re-chromed. Still waiting to get them back - long story.

I have gotten to the point of cleaning and "making usable" parts that I had previously wanted to completely replace or get re-chromed. I figure if I get the bike together and running, I can always replace or re-chrome those items as I get to it ($$$) rather than let the whole project sit and slowly accumulate pieces.
1966 175 DT and 1968 350 GTR

Offline slawsonb

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Re: 175 DT - 1966
« Reply #36 on: June 08, 2015, 04:59:01 PM »
Looking good, dcr!
...bert

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Re: 175 DT - 1966
« Reply #37 on: July 05, 2015, 09:03:34 PM »
Richard posted a classified ad for someone else that was selling a Bridgestone 200 motor. I wasn't interested until I saw a 717 phone number which is my area code. A quick call and they guy is 10 miles from me. We met up on Saturday and it turns out the motor is a complete 175 from a Dual Twin. Its in pretty good shape for having sat for a very long time. Fortunately, the previous owner had the forethought to dump a lot of oil in the case to keep moisture away.

I don't really need a complete motor, but can definitely use a number of the parts in my rebuild and I hate to see this thing end up getting scrapped, which is where the previous owner was headed with it if no one bought it. I asked him where he got it and it turns out it was given to him by a guy I went to high school with. He had planned to put it in a backyard go-cart but never got around to it. Maybe thats a good thing.

The crank is in great shape but they right cylinder is slightly delaminated. Left cylinder is in great shape. I'm slightly curious how the alignment dots got so far off.
1966 175 DT and 1968 350 GTR

Offline OldSwartout

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Re: 175 DT - 1966
« Reply #38 on: July 06, 2015, 11:04:58 AM »

I'm slightly curious how the alignment dots got so far off.

That's normal, each gear has an odd number of teeth and different from all the others.  Another 100 revs or so and they'll all line up again.
Karl Swartout
Mooresville, IN
BS175 Roadracer
BS350 GTR

Offline dcr

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Re: 175 DT - 1966
« Reply #39 on: July 09, 2015, 01:27:17 PM »
So, the dots get aligned when assembling the motor, but then due to having various numbers of teeth and being odd sizes, they become misaligned and then realign every so many revolutions?

Just making sure i understand this concept.

Dan
1966 175 DT and 1968 350 GTR

 


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